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About this Episode

We hope you found value in part one of this podcast. Thank you for joining us for this second segment. Welcome to today’s episode of The Communication Solution podcast with Casey Jackson, John Gilbert and Danielle Cantin. We love talking about Motivational Interviewing, and about improving outcomes for individuals, organizations, and the communities that they serve.
In this episode we delve into the concept of New Year’s resolutions, particularly through the lens of motivational interviewing and sustainable behavior change. The discussion explores how individuals and businesses can approach the New Year with a mindset focused on positive change, aligning actions with core values, and the importance of verbalizing goals to trusted, unbiased listeners for clarity and accountability. The podcast also touches on the challenges of maintaining long-term changes and strategies to sustain motivation beyond initial enthusiasm.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Forward-Looking Approach: Casey Jackson emphasizes the importance of a forward-looking approach in motivational interviewing, contrasting it with traditional psychotherapy that often delves into the past.
• Cultural Reflections: The hosts discuss how different cultures view relaxation and being present, highlighting the often hectic pace of life in the U.S.
• The Journey of Change: The concept of life being a journey, not just a destination, is explored, suggesting that sustainable change involves enjoying the process, not just focusing on the end goal.
• The Impact of COVID-19: The pandemic is mentioned as a catalyst for people to reassess their lives, priorities, and what truly matters to them, similar to the reflection that occurs around the New Year.
• Sustainability of Change: The hosts discuss the importance of making sustainable changes that align with one’s values, rather than temporary or superficial adjustments.
• Role of External Feedback: John Gilbert emphasizes the value of having external measures or feedback to complement internal reflection and ensure alignment with values and goals.
• The Concept of a ‘New Day’: Casey Jackson introduces the idea of each day being a new opportunity to progress towards goals, rather than seeing setbacks as complete restarts.
• Balancing Internal and External Measures: The discussion acknowledges the importance of balancing internal feelings and motivations with external, objective measures for sustainable behavior change.
• Invitation for Listener Engagement: The podcast concludes with an invitation for listeners to share their thoughts, agreements, disagreements, and topic ideas, emphasizing the interactive nature of the podcast.

You don’t want to miss this one! Make sure to rate us or share this podcast. It would mean so much to us!
Thank you for listening to the communication solution. This podcast is all about you. If you have questions, thoughts, topic suggestions, or ideas, please send them our way at casey@ifioc.com. For more resources, feel free to check out ifioc.com.

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Transcribe

Hello and welcome to the communication solution podcast with Casey Jackson and John Gilbert. I’m your host, Danielle Cantin, here at the Institute for Individual and Organizational Change, otherwise known as IFIOC. We love to talk about communication. We love to talk about solutions and we love to talk about providing measurable results for individuals, organizations, and the communities they serve. Welcome to the communication solution that will change your world.

Hello everyone and welcome to Creation Solution. I’m Danielle Cantin, your facilitator for today and I am here with your hosts Casey Jackson and John Gilbert. Hey guys. Hey Danielle. Hey Danielle. Hey, I’m excited for this episode today.  I thought we could dig into a topic that I’m, I want to say might be really emphasized in the U. S. But I’m sure it’s felt somewhat across the globe.  The new year and with the new year comes It’s lots of ideas around resolutions and such. And that makes me think of motivational interviewing and how that might affect, you know, not only the fresh start that we look at as an individual with, Hmm, what might we like to go into this new year with, but also as a business, you know, people are looking at that as well.

And when I think of resolutions and, you know, you have to laugh at the age-old. Sayings and beliefs of like, Oh yeah, you go at it hard on January 1st and you know, you peter out with that long-term behavior change. So I thought that could be a really fun topic to think about motivational interviewing, the communication solution, and maybe how to reframe or think about the new year and in a way that could help people take steps forward in a really positive way.

You know, I think it’s fascinating when you were just talking about it and kind of introducing this, Danielle, I don’t know why, but my brain just went to the difference between motivational interviewing and kind of, I was raised a little bit more in the psychotherapy realm.  You know, I was going through my schooling, be a therapist and, and I think that really for me is a bit the difference.

What I love about motivational interviewing is who do you want to be from today forward.  Psychotherapy is talking about what’s happened to you in the past. And, and so I, there’s something that just, I think the thought of new years, I think in so many different celebrations around the world, always have this kind of celebration of new life or rebirth or starting from here or moving forward.

And, and that part just really, that intrigues me. It literally almost lightens my chest even talking about that. Like, just think if, If your thought process was, where do you want to put your foot today? Where do you want to take a step towards today? And I think that is the nature of New Year’s resolution of, you know, the year is gone.

You take a deep breath, you know, give your loved ones a hug, shake off the last year, and then think about literally baby New Year is you’ve got a fresh start. You, you, who do you want to be? How do you want to navigate this? I think what happens where we falter is we straddle our old thinking and our old behaviors and try to straddle that with new thinking and kind of this excitement on New Year’s Eve and New Year’s resolutions.

And then we move back into our old life. And if you’re going to do that, you’re just not going to make progress. And I think this from that, I mean, just brainstorming out loud. And I think that’s one of the things that I wrestled with as a therapist is, you know, every week you talk about what’s happened the week before and, and how that relates to trauma from the past.

And, and I don’t think that’s bad or wrong, but I think that consumes energy for what do you want to do today about tomorrow?  So all the, the moments I’m talking about the past and. And the past week are moments that I’m not paying attention to the present. And what can I be doing to create the life that I want today?

And from this point forward, I think I’m in such a transformation myself right now, living this and believing this,  you know, implementing all the things I know about health and growth and mindset. And teaching it, it’s very present in my mind in a, in a dimensional and visceral way for me right now. So it is interesting that, you know, you brought up the topic of New Year’s because I’m really in this kind of trying to be forward growth mindset,  and feeling the potency of it and how, how many people want to pull you back into old ways of being.

And I think that’s the same for New Year. Yeah. And I think also that is such a brilliant insight because it’s not just other people want to pull you in, but it’s what we know. So it’s just like, Oh my God, I want to leap into this future that doesn’t exist yet. And I want to do it from a place that I’m familiar with, which is contradictory.

I’m also secretly laughing because I’m drinking out of a coffee cup that says counselor, the counselor, which is, you know, just cracks me up because it’s very true about, it’s all about looking back and our facial interview viewing is looking about looking forward. That’s exactly it. And, and I think from.

You know, as I think about this, we’ve all talked about this before with businesses and sustainability and, you know, and I know we need to talk about this on a separate podcast as well, but I think that when you’re thinking about if you’re going to sustain or have forward movement, it just requires change.

And so many people find, we know we find comfort in status quo. You, you, you, there’s, it’s, it’s, it’s the old pair of sweats. It’s the old blanket we like to cuddle with. It’s our old coffee mug that we like to find and pour. It’s just, we like that stability and chronic change is just hard on our brains.

It’s hard on our biology, chronic change. I mean, it’s good for growth, but there also needs to be a time for reset and. you know, regroup as well, too. And I think our world is so chaotic that we’re chronically in a state of change. It doesn’t feel like we get a lot of status quo, except this is where I think why I like that we attempt to think more globally.

There is the U. S. phenomenon that we just Can’t sit down, you have to be multitasking. So I think there is this, how much do we have to do it and how much have we bought into, you know, kind of a, a cultural phenomenon that if you’re sitting down, you’re wasting time and you’re not productive anymore and you don’t have value.

When you compare that to more traditional cultures, where that’s an art, the art of relaxing, the art of just leaning into being the art of being present.  Those are the things that I think, I think our brains get wrapped around this. Go, go, go, go, go.  And I think, and. As we go, go, go, go, go. If people are not feeling fulfilled by multitasking, which I think COVID brought up this quiet quitting and all these other, you know, the great resignation and all these things that all of a sudden, when we do stop for a second, it’s like, what the hell am I doing?

Like, am I think I’m going crazy and I have nothing to show for it, which is why I think younger generations historically have always said, we’re not going to be crazy. Like you are. You know, we’re going to have a work life balance, and this has been since the dawn of man. You know, as soon as we had civilizations, I think younger generations always said, we’re not going to be crazy like you all are.

 And, and then they end up getting sucked into the same thing about productivity. Yeah. That shift is really interesting that you can even see in the U S happening.  And I know having traveled overseas, that was a big awareness for me was, Oh my God, there’s such a.  Centered quality to,  the countries I visited where there was just this confidence in this quietness in, like you said, the art of relaxing, of really being in the moment and enjoying it.

And I kind of brought that back for me to the U. S. and I do see it since COVID people more re evaluating.  So when I think about the, the new year and approaching that. It really makes sense to stop and pause and really make sure whatever choices you want to make, whether it’s for yourself individually or your business, where I see the connection for motivational interviewing, the opportunity is make sure whatever you’re choosing, is it aligned with your values?

Instead of just a task to do or a thing I’m going to work out every day, I want to do this, tie it up, up the mountain. So you, so, you know, in your training, is that accurate? That’s it. And this is where you, when you’re thinking about for me, a new year’s resolution is. It’s not, am I going to lose weight?

It’s not, am I going to, you know, drop that last 10 pounds? It’s not that I’m going to hit the gym every day. It’s for me, the, the behavior changes I stick to consistently, this is where I just, you know, have such a deep appreciation for all the things John’s brought in my life is truly that construct of lifestyle medicine is it’s not about the five pounds of 10 pounds of 50 pounds.

It’s how’s your lifestyle today going to lead you to where you want to be. And that links so tightly with motivational interviewing is I have control over what I choose today. One little, this is one very concrete, silly thing that I do, but so effective for me,  with all of my eating behaviors, even being vegetarian, just all that my eating behaviors is like when I want ice cream or whatever it is, it’s like, you know what, today we’re not tomorrow.

You can totally have it. Let’s just kind of skip it today. It’s when I get into a deprivation mindset that I struggle. But when I just make an active choice that today I’m not going to, but tomorrow you can totally have two bowls if you want to, Casey, that, that makes it more of a lifestyle thing. And then each day that I kind of stay focused on that, and I genuinely believe that I, in, my narrative isn’t to trick myself, or, what it really is, is I genuinely believe tomorrow if I want to have a bowl of ice cream, I can have a bowl of ice cream.

I believe that. And I also believe right now, it’s not in my best interest to do that for my health.  And I don’t really need it right now, but if I need it tomorrow, I can totally have it tomorrow. So, and I think that makes it less about the five pounds or am I going to the gym? It’s just like every day, am I living in a way that my behavior is lining up with my values?

And for mine, Especially around my health is just, am I having integrity in the way that I’m operating? And I am wildly imperfect, but at least that I know more often than not I’m taking, trying to take steps towards the top of the mountains.  And, and there’s days that I just don’t want to, and I’m partying in a field.

You know, and having fun in the meadow and dancing and drinking and having a great time, you know, and then when I wake up, then I start taking steps towards the top of the mountain again. And that’s part of the journey as well. It’s not just a, a trudge to the top of the mountain, because that’s not the only reason I think that I’m here.

I’m here to party in some meadows every once in a while as well, too. I’m so borrowing that whole bit for me. Oh my God. And you know, you bring up a great, a great point. I can’t wait to hear from you, John, on this, just given your background and. And please share that too, because I’m not sure everybody listening,  is aware of your expertise.

Yeah. Well, the short of the long is,  getting a master’s for human nutrition, dietician, clinical exercise, physiologist. Health coach, all that good stuff. Realizing that I probably should have done, you know, physician assistant or some sort of ARNP assistant, you know, nurse practitioner or something to have my own practice.

But anyhow, getting a bunch of alphabets. So I’m really glad you didn’t. Yeah. Yeah. It all worked out the way it was meant to. And that’s all I’m going to say about that.

So it’s been an interesting journey,  going deep into the communication and behavior change side, because that’s really what we know we’re talking about health right now, but of course, this is beyond health into other areas of it could be, you know, financial stuff, organization stuff with papers or digital or wherever, you know, we’re talking about, but the reason I want to highlight what you’re talking about, Danielle and Casey, what you’re building off and off on is the importance of, well, what are we talking about?

Right? What does it mean to have a new year’s resolution? And you know, this is where, well, we’re trying to help resolve something. So some kind of change, but like Casey, you were just talking about that might mean ongoing pursual. Or maintenance of something, right? And what is that something? Well, ideally, we’re going to have a sense of whatever that something is our health or something related to that, that we can then measure, right?

So we need to have some sense of reflection of what are we doing that’s aligning with our values and what’s not. And that’s what you two are both talking about, right? What, what are the things that I’m doing that are helping me get where I want to go, where I get some fulfillment from dancing and drinking or whatever the thing is?

 Where does that line of the, the mountains start to become, maybe this isn’t as fulfilling or helping me in other ways, right? So where is that sense of that? And have you hit quote unquote, Some people have to hit quote unquote rock bottom whereas other people kind of sense that earlier or get feedback from people around them earlier about their health or their doctor from labs, right?

So I think there’s something to be said here about well, how would you know that your behavior is getting you? Where you want to go or not. And I think there’s a discussion that I’m kind of curious, Danielle and Casey, what your thoughts are. And like, well, how would you know? And how do you help yourself?

And how do you help other people align their behaviors with their values? And what does that look like? What does that sound like? And what, where would be the line? I think that’s an interesting concept to think about if MI is trying to help people get their behavior aligned with their values. I think, you know, what I think of John is that it, it does come down to how any individual wants to look at the quality of their life or the quality of their community, if it’s more communal based, you know, is, is my behavior in alignment with that.

Ikeep going back to the, these cultural phenomenons, at least in the U S in terms of, you know, the great resignation or quiet quitting. That wasn’t just a handful of people that was, that was across our culture that that happened. So, which is a basic, I think there’s partly a reset when I go to COVID and I’m making this connection of a reset between new years and even COVID is there’s a moment where it’s like, wait a second, what do I want to do?

And who am I? And I think that’s the same opportunity with. You know, kind of a new year’s resolution construct or,  you know, Chinese or new year’s kind of thing. It’s just like this, I’m starting from new, you know, I’m kind of going, who am I now? Where, where do I want to go? And I think, you know, the, the phenomenon of the pandemic really caused people to really rethink what is important in my life.

And it pulled us to a. Into basically a survival mode. And so when you’re starting from scratch from a survival mode, it’s like you kind of partially wipe the slate clean. Is this the career that I want? Is this the relationship I want? Is this financially where I want to be? Like, what are my priorities?

Am I, am I living the life that I want? And now that I’m being just brought down to. I can’t leave my house and I have some nervousness over my own, you know, mortality, what really matters to me. And I think, I think that’s a profound place for people to be at. And so it’s a much more extreme, very much more extreme version than New Year’s Eve, but it’s the same construct.

What is important and who do you want to be and what would your life look like if your behavior was aligning with what your deeper values are? And I think because in our culture. When we talk, when I talk about Focus Mountain, you know, and it’s just, it’s just the concept of that mountain with the values of the top and then just all these trees that are just numerous, countless trees that we can get lost in about family and relationship and kids and job and, you know, everything we just, it’s social media, it’s just wrapped around our heads 24 seven.

I think of it like,  you know, the, I’ve been using this analogy lately with the, the, the,  The briars in the black forest that springs up in sleeping beauty when the queen just is like, I’m going to stop you from getting to sleeping beauty. Or I think of the trees in Wizard of Oz throwing apples at, you know, Dorothy and the Scarecrow.

It’s just like, in those moments, that’s all we pay attention to is the trees. And then we lose sight of Oz or we lose sight of, you know, sleeping beauty in the castle because the, the, the potency of the here and now, and the fear and the anxiety and the, this, the senses of it being insurmountable distract us.

And I think that is no different than when we, you know, are giving friends hugs on New Year’s Eve and saying, okay, this is my year. And then within, you know, a month we’re back into the old routine. Because it’s just like, we’re back in the trees again, and it’s, we’re just doing the daily grind and we lose sight of the princess and Oz, you know, it just, and that’s, that for me is, you know, Daniel, you keep leaning so heavy into the, be the change because you can see the potency and the potential there, you know, that we’re starting.

And for me, it’s just, how do you live this? Lifestyle. How, how do you live with this level of mindfulness? It’s not even lifestyle. It’s such a, a daily consciousness. You know, you can hear about it in any self help book or any, any self help guru will talk the same basic construct, but to be able to operationalize it.

That it feels like it’s part of who you are and how you’re operating. I think that is always the, how do I find that keystone that unlocks all of this? You know, I can hear it and I can want it and I can crave it. And I can cry over it and say, and kick my feet and say, I want this. I want this. I’ll do anything.

But do we, do we. What’s that formula to get it. And it’s, I think you touched on, on what’s needed and why I love the communication solutions so much is because, you know, as a branding specialist. It’s that journey. It’s a hero’s journey. We’re storytellers, right? Your brand is a, is a story. And how many times do we get caught up in the forest, like you described?

That’s such a cool analogy.  You’re so good at those, but it’s like we get stuck there and it’s like we can have the best intentions, whether it’s for ourselves, for our business, our team. But if we don’t hold ourselves accountable with communication, it can’t just all be in our minds of our head if we don’t have that support.

And I think, I think that’s why I’m so passionate about be the change because I’m like, where is that ongoing support for the people who are out there? And we are deeply committed. To this level of transformation, this level of staying connected to Focus Mountain, to those values for ourselves, for our team, for our business.

 What kind of support do those people need? And yes, we have trainings and all of that, but it’s like that consistent touch point for, for folks.  You know, I think that’s the value of motivational interviewing. And the way we tend to approach this is what we know is that we can have all sorts of internal narratives in our head.

There is something about when it comes out of your mouth. It sounds so good in our head. And we can justify things and deny things in our own head. But it just sounds different when it comes out of our mouth. And if somebody hears it and kind of paints what we’re saying on the, on the wall in front of us, and then we have to think and go, wow, is that what I really think?

Is that what I really feel? And here, let me erase this little part of it and clarify this piece of it. That is the function of motivational interviewing to have somebody that’s, you know, from them. Our version of motivational interviewing that is unbiased, that’s really listening to you, helping you, your thoughts out of your head back up on the wall.

And then as you’re kind of painting this mural or putting this mosaic together, this is why we always talk focus mountain is we’re always looking at that. Those thoughts and those behaviors in alignment with your own values as you define them, as you define yourself and as your behavior in line with that, that, that human interaction, I think is the, the beauty of having human interaction.

I mean, to me, it’s one of the reasons we’re on the planet is to be able to not just be little marbles in a vase, but to interface with each other differently. And that to me is really important for, to, to be able to have this human exchange that we’re both better off because we. Engaged in this and, and to take that as the spirit from which you’re operating from and help another human being get clear about their own value system and their own behavior without trying to guilt them or pressure them or persuade them, you know, or coax them to do it in a different way that you’re, you’re igniting that from within.

That which they would they want to be that what that which they desire inside themselves. I just don’t understand why everybody wouldn’t want to do that. I mean, immediately I just think, my God, I’m so lucky I have my career. This, why wouldn’t you want to do this? And you can, even I can pay my rent, my mortgage just by helping other people figure these things out and, and me feel better because of it.

And it’s like, that’s how I draw down a paycheck. Like, are you freaking kidding me? Why doesn’t everybody want to do this? But I just know that that’s not everybody’s calling either.  But that’s why I think that, you know, we all have such a passion, you know, John, for, you know, diving into the whole world of health and human growth from that perspective.

And me from a mental, emotional, spiritual side of it, you just find your like minded people that are like, why would we not want to help people be the best version of themselves as they define themselves? Like that, that just, that’s just. That’s a language my brain understands. That’s why I love John. And just because of what you said of, Oh, I should have gone down this path.

And it’s like, Oh God, no, because the amount of organizations, you know, just think of all of, all of the organizations that you help that literally are like, what? You have an expert like John in our area of expertise. That can weave in motivational interviewing and understands, you know, what, what they’re doing, because they’re trying to help people improve their health, their fitness, you know, what their, their nutrition, what they’re eating.

 So it’s really awesome that you’re, to me, you’re kind of that bridge that helps those organizations.  So I think you’re in a perfect spot beyond what Casey was saying, like, just cause we have you, but it’s like, there’s, there’s really immense value with your expertise layered in on it too. Well, first I’ll just say, thank you.

That is very kind of you to say that, but more importantly.  Yeah, I think it comes into what we’re talking about with the impact we want to make in case you help me get clear early on about kind of going further upstream to help people help people a little bit more.  And what that means for the world.

And then in so doing, I had to balance that out with other values,  you know, and think about the other areas. And then as we grow and we have a life. We get clear about our values. And this is where I think it’s interesting to think about our earlier conversation, because be it with friends or counselors, like your cup is saying Danielle or therapists, they can help like with Casey and how he was trained.

They can help with insight into, is this a new thing that looks like an old pattern? And so is it really new, right? Is it really change or is it a repetition of the same? And I think that’s really important to recognize that sometimes Seeking help can help us get clear about is this really a new resolution or is it just painted in a different way in my mind versus maybe I’m just repeating patterns.

The other thing is there’s also something to be said about talking about change out loud, Casey, that you’re talking about of just that alone and focusing on that has a lot of good research. So it could be insight. from the past to inform the now. It could also be about the now moving forward. But I also think part of this discussion is that it’s easy to talk about focus, mountain and values when we have experience with it.

But at the same time, it’s like, well, what is a value versus a tree, right? And, and we’ve talked about this on other pod, podcasts, but Casey, your example of, you know, family being a value versus this sense of contribution to the world, this sense of legacy, the sense of feeling connection of a part of a tribe.

All of those things seem to be core values that are really important. So I just think that’s its own insight too is insight into what are our values and what’s this feeling I’m having of not rightness versus rightness or trueness to who I am. I think that sort of space to self reflect and that sort of insight is its own thing, whatever we want to label that.

But I just think that’s important where someone like A person trained in EMI could help someone be, make more values based decisions about their life, whatever exact label they want to do, label it, but about how much is their behavior getting them what they want or not. And so I just want to highlight, there’s a.

A broad picture of you could do that as a friend. Ethically, like Casey, you were getting that,  you could do that as a counselor. You could do that as a therapist, but there’s this balance of how are we being in the world and how much is that getting us where we want to go and the impact we’re trying to have.

And it seems like the one thing we haven’t talked about, maybe with resolution that I know, Danielle, you had brought up is the sustainability of that. Because I know getting working on getting hours from my board certification and. In adult weight management that it’s extremely difficult, especially in our culture, to keep off weight that we lose.

And so that’s one of many examples that is hard to sustain. So I think that’s something that we could talk about if we wanted to spend a few minutes is the sustainability of what are we focused on and how would you know? You know, that you’re sustaining a change versus not. And I think it comes back Casey to what you said, but I’m, I’m curious if we want to take it there, like sustainability of your new year’s resolution, how do you do that?

Or how does that relate to MI or something along those lines? Yeah, I think that’s really, really interesting. And it almost feels like a little two part podcast. I like how we go with the flow sometimes here.  I would say let’s dig into sustainability because. What I’ve heard from you guys,  is as we look to the new year, I love the correlation with COVID.

 It’s the same kind of framework in terms of we have this opportunity to hit reset and not, not so much look backwards as, Hey, now where am I and where do I want to go? And the, the vision is always related to Focus Mountain and your values. So how do you start to uncover those values to make sure you’re aligned?

 So the other thing I heard there too is something that’s helpful is not only to think about your values, but actually start verbalizing to somebody that you trust that can be non judgmental, right? And doesn’t have skin in the game, so to speak, that can really hear you and be that reflection so that you can map out a new, to your point, Casey, mural on the wall, right?

So it’s just like, Oh God, that was in my head, but now that I see it. Reflected through, through you, is that really what I want?  So these are really wonderful tips.  Anything to add you guys? And I think maybe we should maybe shift to the sustainability piece,  if that sounds good. Well, and I think that for me, the segue is.

Think of the concept of New Year’s or rebirth or restart is a great place to start with and then the sustainability of it. So it’s that whole thing about what is the top of my mountain? How do I want to navigate the trees in front of me? Sustainability for me, I think we did touch on a bit in terms of it’s that one foot in front of the other.

It’s, you know, we can, you know, party in the field, but then get back on the path and start climbing back to the top of the mountain is sustainability.  And, and, and I think getting away from this, I think of the culture I was raised in specifically around the addiction world as a professional and relapse was just such a dirty word.

It just, it, it meant you lost everything. Every time you relapsed, you lost everything and that was the mindset in substance use. Was if you relapse, you lost everything and you start from scratch. And what I like from a growth mindset and to move away from that, you know, black and white thinking is that just because we went and partied in the field, and I’m not going to say this for people with substance use, that, that equivalency it’s, I don’t want to make that equivalency, but if we’re climbing up the mountain and we, and we choose to, you know, you know, sleep on the side of the path for a couple of days or a week or go fishing.

That’s part of the journey to it doesn’t mean we’re necessarily walking, taking steps towards top amount, but when you pull off to a creek and set up camp and fish for a while and enjoy the, you know, the view and the beauty of the nature and then you pack up and get back on the, that is what for me, sustainability is, it’s not, Oh my God, we just lost a week.

That, that’s such a, it’s, I just don’t like that mindset. That mindset is just such a deprivation mindset, or, you know, I made a bad decision mindset versus a growth mindset. This is like, I can’t even, I’m like, Oh my God, this is so transformational on every level. Oh my gosh. And I’m so secretly selfish.

Cause I’m like, that’s when I get stuck when I make it bad that I’m fishing or that you start and I’m a such a start from scratch, start from scratch. Like, cause I love fresh start. Right. Yes, it completely has hurts all the entire journey that got you to that point of quote unquote quitting. Yes. You know what?

And Danielle, even what you just said, it’s like, and it just clicked in my brain as soon as you said it, it’s the difference between a fresh start and a new day. At the end of seven days of fishing, you wake up to a new day. That’s not a fresh start. That’s a new day. So it’s so nice to think that there’s a new day and it’s not a fresh start because you fished for a week or you, you know, danced in a field for a week with your friends.

That’s that just means. And then when you wake up, you go, ah, I think I’m satiated. And I think it’s time to pack up now and start back up towards the top of the mountain and just with, you know, savoring those journeys makes each step. You know, over these rocks a little bit easier because you’re savoring the fishing trip and you’re savoring the dancing.

And, and now you’re five more steps closer to the top of the mountain. I think, isn’t that why we’re here? I mean, it isn’t, we talk about it’s the journey. Let’s enjoy the journey. So instead of a new start, a new start means that you’ve got dropped all the way back down to the trailhead again. And it’s like, Oh my gosh, that is such a, that’s that relapse mindset.

That’s like, oh, you know, I got knocked back to the trailhead and I got to start over again. And it’s like, oh my, what,  that causes stress in my chest. I know, I played Monopoly, but I feel like there’s the Monopoly correlation there too. It’s like, oh no, I’d rather just wake up in the morning after, you know, fishing or partying or whatever and just go, okay, I’m ready to start climbing to the top of the mountain again until my next, you know, time to take a timeout happens.

So how do you weave the excitement and the lure and the love of the fresh start new year without completely putting the new day away because it isn’t a fresh start unless you’re a brand new person. Thinking baby, right? Right, right. This is the beauty in looking from baby new year perspective into, you know, how do they integrate it into a chaos, you know, multitasking life.

And I think that’s where it’s like, this is about the journey. It’s never losing sight about what the top of the mountain is. And why are you here? We’re only, you only get so long to walk to the top of the mountain and we may not achieve it, but it’s about the journey to get there. The delusion is that we’re going to get there.

I mean, I would, I would, I’d love to get there, but after I literally had been working on getting to the top of the mountain, cognizantly, I had been so mindful and conscious of my own mental, emotional, spiritual, physical health. I’ve been conscious of that since I was 18 or 19 years old. That’s why I got in the field as early as I did.

It’s like, it was, I just knew it was my calling. And it’s when I get distracted by thinking that it’s to get the degree or get the initials or to get the private practice or to get the podcast or to get the, it’s, those are the delusions. It’s like, that is not my journey. Those are just all these adventures I get to have for me being able to help another human being, have a happier and healthier life.

Whether I ever get a dollar for it or not, it really is. That is my, that’s my journey and I’ve been doing it since I was little and I will continue to do it until I’m no longer here. Like it just, that’s the journey. It’s when I get diluted by all these other things that they define who I am. When I know who I am, I am somebody that gets emotional at being able to connect with other human beings intimately and seeing our lives change and transform because of it.

That’s the everything else is just becomes trees and trees and trees and trees about. Well, that’s inappropriate. That’s not okay. Or why aren’t you charging for that? Or why are you doing this? Or why? It’s like, Oh, my God. Oh, my God. It makes me not want to be on the journey anymore. And that’s not fun. I love the journey.

I love the journey. This is a mic drop on sustaining behavior. We just went for it, John. Casey just took us on a tour. I don’t know, any comments or thoughts, John? This was amazing. Well, to the point of what Casey’s bringing up, it’s this sense of, are you feeling this light up ness, this lit up ness, this sense of alignment?

And I think that’s absolutely an internal thing. I think there’s also an external thing to keep in mind around sustainability, too, of like, well, what are the things that you can look to to know if you are aligning, right? And that’s where my world of health care with labs or things that you can measure might come in.

And I just want to highlight sometimes there’s this internal sense. And with all the biases we all have of doing mental gymnastics to make us feel amazing as best we can that sometimes it’s good to have measures outside of ourself or things we check in with regularly if it is going to be a more subjective thing.

And I would just add that to the of we know that with finances, if we’re in debt, that’s a pretty objective measure or certain things with weight and energy balance. That’s a pretty objective measure. There’s labs. Those are more objective measures, right? I just would add that to the mix that there’s this internalness and a potential externalness because what you measure probably matters and just what matters to you and just continuing to keep in mind.

External and internal ways of being in the world and senses of that to just help you be where you want to be and then seek out people that can help you, hopefully with things like am I to hear yourself out loud, talk about change and try to help that for other people in the most ethical, balanced way possible, and we will be in the realm of what we’re trying to do.

Sounds good to me. Yeah, that’s awesome. What a great conversation. Thank you so much, you guys.  I don’t know. I’m pretty excited for a new day. Sounds good to me. Awesome. Thank you so much, you guys. I’ll see you on the next episode of viewers. Thanks listeners. Thanks for being with us. Please send your questions into Casey at IFIOC.

 And reach out. We want to hear what you think, what you’re going through. Do you agree? Disagree?  Topic ideas, you name it. We can’t wait to hear from you. Thanks so much for being here with us. See you next time. Take care. Take care. Thank you for listening to the communication solution podcast with Casey Jackson and John Gilbert.

As always, this podcast is about empowering you on your journey to change the world. So if you have questions, suggestions, or ideas, send them our way at Casey at IFIOC. com. That’s Casey@IFIOC.com. For more information or to schedule a training, visit IFIOC. com. Until our next communication solution podcast, keep changing the world.